VH 06/26/78: Kyoto Kaikan Hall, Kyoto, Japan

Oddly, I don’t. I have Nagoya 6/24 and Osaka 6/25 and 6/27. Hmmm…

ron: The reason I asked is: -There’s a question about whether this show actually took place -It’s been on tour date lists forever -The VHE says an audio recording exists

Where is CJ when you need him!? I wonder who his source was on that one. There isn’t even a bootleg release of the show after all these years and with every other show listed having been recorded, it does seem odd that that single show is missing. Of course that Pogo’s show was out there and it was never listed, so it’s possible there is something out there that someone is sitting on.

I’ve never seen this show available, let alone existing somewhere.

There is a Kyoto show from ’79.

tommyv: Here’s a link to part of Noel Monk’s auction…confirms no show.

That’s the source of this investigation. So if there was no show, where does the city, venue and supposed audio recording come from?

Basically, how trustworthy are those records? They’ve been proven to be problematic in the past, that’s why I’d like to figure out where this info (right or wrong) came from.

voodoo: I’m thinking this is right from the auction items that were provided as auction items, since it’s directly posted on their website? No?

Right. What I’m saying is that just because it’s typed onto a sheet of paper, doesn’t mean that it happened that way. Changes happen along the way. I’m leaning toward “the date didn’t happen”, but I’d like more proof. For example, what does the book that came out in Japan earlier this year that Cato took part in, have to say about that date?

I must also note, I have run into several people who had unknown shows listed over the years and have tried to make trades with them only to have them never respond or reply and say it was an error and the show was actually a different band. Also, as I said before, I’ve had multiple times when I first started trading that people would say they had an unreleased show and then send me a tape of a known show with songs cut or song order rearranged just to get a trade for something else.

Lest we forget the “Unreleased ’77 demos” that turned out to be the soundcheck for the 10-15-77 show what was labeled and traded as 12-20-77 for years and the Starwood shows that circulated as incorrect dates for years, until Wooda came out and released his masters with the actual corrected dates. The VHE also listed several early shows that people had on their lists that turned out to be incorrectly ID’d (my list included).

Unless or until an actual recording is released that can be positively identified as being at this location on this tour (Dave always says the city name at some point and the setlist will be the giveaway) I would think it’s safe to say it didn’t happen and it doesn’t exist.

Just my .02.

ron: I guess what I needed was help researching this to try and prove something one way or the other.You’ve done a great job convincing me, but truth be told, I’d really like just one more item.The Japanese book that Cato helped put together earlier this year.Does anyone have it, and what does it have on this date, if anything?

Sorry that I’m so damn skeptical, but I’ve learned not to trust tour itineraries, etc… Changes happen that don’t get documented in those, and errors remain for years and years and years, and are extremely hard to correct.

I don’t mean to come across as stubborn, I just want to put a nail in this coffin, and not have to re-open it.

LOL you stubborn bastard!!

I get it. The Pogo’s show is the perfect example of this. So, if Cato knows something no one else knows or is talking about, then by all means, that is who we need to verify all of this. Personally, with all of the evidence pointing to this NOT existing, I wouldn’t be convinced it did exist unless at least some of the audio was released to prove it.